The Trinity Test...Humperdinck
Jul. 13th, 2008 09:05 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
rabid1stThis one is about Ten. And it is very very long...sorry about that.
Did anyone know that the first test of an implosive plutonium bomb was at a test site known as Trinity? Neat, huh? When placed against the concept of the three-fold man, it makes me smile.
"I am become death, the destroyer of worlds." -- Oppenheimer when he saw what he had created. "I name you destroyer of worlds," Davros, pointing at Ten.
Nine once said, "Oh, don't worship me, I'd make a terrible god."
Ten told Jack, that Rose had looked into the Time Vortex and "If a Time Lord did that he'd become a god, a vengeful god." He went on to say that it was Rose's humanity that saved her. But now we know that Ten has no humanity in him.
"And the Doctor's soul shall be revealed at the end of days."
"Oh, that's it, the anger, the fire, the rage of a time lord who butchered millions. Why so shy? Show your companion...your true self."
"So dark and cold...fire is coming...the endless flames." -- Caan
Ten, the darkest Doctor we have ever had, is at his nadir point. His soul is dark and cold and full of fire. He has gone from identifying with the cybermen to identifying with the Master...to finally identifying with Davros. "She is mine to do with as I will," Davros says of Rose. And how literally Ten takes that into him...when he makes Rose the keeper of his accidental creation. But it goes back a little further than that...because there was River Song. River who at the moment of her death realized that HER Doctor had manipulated her into that sacrifice. Still...she was his...willing to do his will to the very end.
Rose is less willing, but she's struggling to understand. Donna isn't willing at all. The Doctor has crossed a line...but where did the shuffling toward it start?
At the very beginning, I think, when he turned on Harriet Jones and took her out of office. Sweet, supportive, lovable Harriet Jones...he liked her. But she crossed him and he punished her. Yes, she did something terrible...shot a beaten enemy in the back as he was leaving. So we were all on Ten's side. Just as we were on it a bit earlier...when the Sycorax betrayed him. But if Harriet Jones is one of his children...why didn't he treat her with more understanding? Okay...he's that sort of man...no second chances.
In New Earth...we meet the Face of Boe...and are told that he waits for one like him...a homeless traveler...a wanderer...the Lonely God. And there it is...we've gone from 'Don't worship me' to the Doctor identified as a God. And more than that he says he's the Doctor and if the Sisterhood want to take it to a higher authority...there isn't one. Absolute moral authority stops with him. And we all cheered...yes, that's more like it! Because the sisterhood is so wrong.
Then, he meets Queen Victoria. Anyone from Old Who will remember how much the Doctor loves Victorian England...and the Queen. But, she doesn't love him. She finds him "strayed so far from the good"...and the werewolf sees "something of the wolf in" Rose. The overall feeling though is Rose and Ten are having a grand time of it...so why bother about a stuffy old Queen who might be part werewolf?
In School Reunion...the Doctor says..."If I don't like it, it will stop." And Mr. Finch sees very clearly that the Doctor will want what he's selling...a chance to go back and save everyone...become a god. He also sees what the Doctor wants...an unchanging companion. Which is interesting given that earlier Mr. Finch says that is indicative of Time Lords..."ancient, dusty Senators so frightened of change." And the Doctor admits that it is his curse to watch those he loves wither and die...more than that...he links it to why he leaves people. Interestingly, the Doctor doesn't reject godhood when it is offered. It is Sarah Jane who says things must evolve...everything ends. Always we refer this to his relationship with Rose...it will end...but it is more applicable to his people, his time...even HIM.
Rose is human and will die one day...but he doesn't want to accept that limitation. He's still refusing to face it at Journey's End. He's still trying to save everyone...as he said with that glazed look in School Reunion. "I could save everyone."
Once Rose begins to assert her influence over him mid-Season 2...we see less of the darkness bubbling up to the surface. And we see something VERY important...we see him ask her how long she will stay with him. She says forever. The difference between this forever and Donna's...is that the Doctor ASKS Rose for this one. He needs it...and she knows this.
Yes, he and Rose are inappropriately gleeful in the face of tragedy...and he names them the stuff of legends...and even elevates Rose to her own form of godhood. "If I believe in anything, I believe in her." I still think that she's a positive influence on him...and as he says as he leave her, it is very him to need her. We only see his raging darkness surface when she's taken away...like in The Idiot's Lantern...when he is a very edgy man indeed. "Because that makes things very, very simple." and "No power on this earth can stop me." and "I want my friend back." <<--We get this petulant request in a number of places...Gridlock for example. Ten rages at the world.
In the Runaway Bride he commits near genocide...killing the Racnoss children. We learn in Left Turn that if Donna hadn't stopped him he would have killed the queen and himself. They ARE the bad guys...but hardly on the same emotionless level as the Daleks. Donna tells him he needs someone to stop him...and he latches onto Martha. And here begins a descent I might not have interpreted well at all. It gave me the willies...but mostly because Martha's blind devotion was creepy. Yet, I didn't blame HIM. Even though, he uses Martha as a crutch...someone to hold his hand. I never really thought he gave her "mixed signals"...but certainly he didn't drop her off on the roadside so she'd get the message and move on with her life.
Religious symbolism starts to mount up in S3...with halos and angels and the old rugged cross. The Doctor tells the alleyway people if they are there when he gets back they will regret it. Also, Martha seems unable to stop him. She is too filled with her religious zeal. And we see him getting darker, edgier, nastier...as he condemns the Family of Blood to horrific and eternal fates. Joan is appalled by him and the death he brought with him. In the Sound of Drums...the Doctor has no patience at all for Martha's concern for her family...he is brutally thoughtless of her. And yet, she travels the world speaking to people of her love for him. He makes her into a soldier...not the first in his army of god...but certainly one of the most devoted to him.
Through Martha's committed missionary work, the Doctor is deified again...becoming the Tinkerbell Jeebus as everyone "believes in him." Well, isn't that special? He offers the Master forgiveness. Is it really his to give? Does he speak for planet Earth now? The Master sneers at the "perfect, safe life" the Doctor offers him. And we see the desperation of the Doctor's loneliness revealed. He would do anything...side with anyone to not be alone anymore. He weeps as the last of his kind dies out again. The you are not alone prophecy seems to be a short lived one.
On the Titanic...where he's having fun, fun, fun...Astrid is swept up in the swirl of love around the Doctor. She is quickly HIS. Again...he tells everyone he's their only hope, they must follow him. But many of them die. He's lifted up on high by angels...to take control of everything. And for the first time...he tries to change the outcome of a life...bring someone back from the dead. And when he fails he rages, "I can do anything." Mr. Copper tells him, "If you really could decide who lives and who dies, you'd be a monster."
I think he's crossed that line, now. Creating virtual lives for people...surrounded by their loved ones...loved ones who must lie or force an issue. Did nobody feel sorry for Wilf who will have to lie to Donna for the rest of his life, even when she's lamenting how she's nobody? Did none of us feel sorry for 10.2, who has the Doctor's love of adventure and is now unwillingly trapped in a loveless marriage? Anyone else but me remember that the Valeyard was a master at creating virtual worlds?
Deciding that the Daleks should live...or be offered life...which is truly a bit mad. Holding his hand out to Davros...well...maybe he was just being a good guy there, right? Except he wasn't being a time lord, because remember...Davros is already dead. Or if he isn't he at the very least came back through the time lock. The Doctor saw him fly into the jaws of the nightmare child. So...he needs to die, just like Rose's father needed to die...or time and space will start to unravel in some way.
Dalek Caan knows this but brought Davros back anyway. So that something ELSE could happen...maybe so that the Doctor's soul could be revealed. Maybe all the time lines end here...not because of the Daleks...but because of the thing with all the prophecy around it...the DoctorDonna...10.2...something brand new in creation, a human/time lord hybrid. "You should not exist," the shadow lady says about 10...and 10 says that about 10.2.
Maybe this really was all about what the prophecy said...the Journey's End...because the Doctor has crossed the line into total identification with his Lonely Godhood. Everything stops there...because he can go back and MAKE it stop. And...since he knows it is possible to break the time lock...how tempting will it be for him to just...fix everything? He could save everyone.
I tell you what there is more than a prophecy that he will do this...there is a canon season...the Trial of the Time Lord. Ten is now a point between regenerations, I think...and we have been watching his descent into the madness of the Valeyard since he arrived. We just didn't know it. Because RTD eclipsed it for a time with the bright sun of Rose Tyler. But now...the Darkness is coming, indeed.
Ten needs someone to stop him...and there's nobody left. I see a bad moon risin'.
Or...you know...that could just be because I've adjusted my meds. :grin:
At this point...Journey's End was what it was, yeah? A bit of big budget epic designed to make as many people as possible happy and the time lords are coming back for Moffat and Eleven will make it all better. New companion on the horizon...I guess. :grin:
Did anyone know that the first test of an implosive plutonium bomb was at a test site known as Trinity? Neat, huh? When placed against the concept of the three-fold man, it makes me smile.
"I am become death, the destroyer of worlds." -- Oppenheimer when he saw what he had created. "I name you destroyer of worlds," Davros, pointing at Ten.
Nine once said, "Oh, don't worship me, I'd make a terrible god."
Ten told Jack, that Rose had looked into the Time Vortex and "If a Time Lord did that he'd become a god, a vengeful god." He went on to say that it was Rose's humanity that saved her. But now we know that Ten has no humanity in him.
"And the Doctor's soul shall be revealed at the end of days."
"Oh, that's it, the anger, the fire, the rage of a time lord who butchered millions. Why so shy? Show your companion...your true self."
"So dark and cold...fire is coming...the endless flames." -- Caan
Ten, the darkest Doctor we have ever had, is at his nadir point. His soul is dark and cold and full of fire. He has gone from identifying with the cybermen to identifying with the Master...to finally identifying with Davros. "She is mine to do with as I will," Davros says of Rose. And how literally Ten takes that into him...when he makes Rose the keeper of his accidental creation. But it goes back a little further than that...because there was River Song. River who at the moment of her death realized that HER Doctor had manipulated her into that sacrifice. Still...she was his...willing to do his will to the very end.
Rose is less willing, but she's struggling to understand. Donna isn't willing at all. The Doctor has crossed a line...but where did the shuffling toward it start?
At the very beginning, I think, when he turned on Harriet Jones and took her out of office. Sweet, supportive, lovable Harriet Jones...he liked her. But she crossed him and he punished her. Yes, she did something terrible...shot a beaten enemy in the back as he was leaving. So we were all on Ten's side. Just as we were on it a bit earlier...when the Sycorax betrayed him. But if Harriet Jones is one of his children...why didn't he treat her with more understanding? Okay...he's that sort of man...no second chances.
In New Earth...we meet the Face of Boe...and are told that he waits for one like him...a homeless traveler...a wanderer...the Lonely God. And there it is...we've gone from 'Don't worship me' to the Doctor identified as a God. And more than that he says he's the Doctor and if the Sisterhood want to take it to a higher authority...there isn't one. Absolute moral authority stops with him. And we all cheered...yes, that's more like it! Because the sisterhood is so wrong.
Then, he meets Queen Victoria. Anyone from Old Who will remember how much the Doctor loves Victorian England...and the Queen. But, she doesn't love him. She finds him "strayed so far from the good"...and the werewolf sees "something of the wolf in" Rose. The overall feeling though is Rose and Ten are having a grand time of it...so why bother about a stuffy old Queen who might be part werewolf?
In School Reunion...the Doctor says..."If I don't like it, it will stop." And Mr. Finch sees very clearly that the Doctor will want what he's selling...a chance to go back and save everyone...become a god. He also sees what the Doctor wants...an unchanging companion. Which is interesting given that earlier Mr. Finch says that is indicative of Time Lords..."ancient, dusty Senators so frightened of change." And the Doctor admits that it is his curse to watch those he loves wither and die...more than that...he links it to why he leaves people. Interestingly, the Doctor doesn't reject godhood when it is offered. It is Sarah Jane who says things must evolve...everything ends. Always we refer this to his relationship with Rose...it will end...but it is more applicable to his people, his time...even HIM.
Rose is human and will die one day...but he doesn't want to accept that limitation. He's still refusing to face it at Journey's End. He's still trying to save everyone...as he said with that glazed look in School Reunion. "I could save everyone."
Once Rose begins to assert her influence over him mid-Season 2...we see less of the darkness bubbling up to the surface. And we see something VERY important...we see him ask her how long she will stay with him. She says forever. The difference between this forever and Donna's...is that the Doctor ASKS Rose for this one. He needs it...and she knows this.
Yes, he and Rose are inappropriately gleeful in the face of tragedy...and he names them the stuff of legends...and even elevates Rose to her own form of godhood. "If I believe in anything, I believe in her." I still think that she's a positive influence on him...and as he says as he leave her, it is very him to need her. We only see his raging darkness surface when she's taken away...like in The Idiot's Lantern...when he is a very edgy man indeed. "Because that makes things very, very simple." and "No power on this earth can stop me." and "I want my friend back." <<--We get this petulant request in a number of places...Gridlock for example. Ten rages at the world.
In the Runaway Bride he commits near genocide...killing the Racnoss children. We learn in Left Turn that if Donna hadn't stopped him he would have killed the queen and himself. They ARE the bad guys...but hardly on the same emotionless level as the Daleks. Donna tells him he needs someone to stop him...and he latches onto Martha. And here begins a descent I might not have interpreted well at all. It gave me the willies...but mostly because Martha's blind devotion was creepy. Yet, I didn't blame HIM. Even though, he uses Martha as a crutch...someone to hold his hand. I never really thought he gave her "mixed signals"...but certainly he didn't drop her off on the roadside so she'd get the message and move on with her life.
Religious symbolism starts to mount up in S3...with halos and angels and the old rugged cross. The Doctor tells the alleyway people if they are there when he gets back they will regret it. Also, Martha seems unable to stop him. She is too filled with her religious zeal. And we see him getting darker, edgier, nastier...as he condemns the Family of Blood to horrific and eternal fates. Joan is appalled by him and the death he brought with him. In the Sound of Drums...the Doctor has no patience at all for Martha's concern for her family...he is brutally thoughtless of her. And yet, she travels the world speaking to people of her love for him. He makes her into a soldier...not the first in his army of god...but certainly one of the most devoted to him.
Through Martha's committed missionary work, the Doctor is deified again...becoming the Tinkerbell Jeebus as everyone "believes in him." Well, isn't that special? He offers the Master forgiveness. Is it really his to give? Does he speak for planet Earth now? The Master sneers at the "perfect, safe life" the Doctor offers him. And we see the desperation of the Doctor's loneliness revealed. He would do anything...side with anyone to not be alone anymore. He weeps as the last of his kind dies out again. The you are not alone prophecy seems to be a short lived one.
On the Titanic...where he's having fun, fun, fun...Astrid is swept up in the swirl of love around the Doctor. She is quickly HIS. Again...he tells everyone he's their only hope, they must follow him. But many of them die. He's lifted up on high by angels...to take control of everything. And for the first time...he tries to change the outcome of a life...bring someone back from the dead. And when he fails he rages, "I can do anything." Mr. Copper tells him, "If you really could decide who lives and who dies, you'd be a monster."
I think he's crossed that line, now. Creating virtual lives for people...surrounded by their loved ones...loved ones who must lie or force an issue. Did nobody feel sorry for Wilf who will have to lie to Donna for the rest of his life, even when she's lamenting how she's nobody? Did none of us feel sorry for 10.2, who has the Doctor's love of adventure and is now unwillingly trapped in a loveless marriage? Anyone else but me remember that the Valeyard was a master at creating virtual worlds?
Deciding that the Daleks should live...or be offered life...which is truly a bit mad. Holding his hand out to Davros...well...maybe he was just being a good guy there, right? Except he wasn't being a time lord, because remember...Davros is already dead. Or if he isn't he at the very least came back through the time lock. The Doctor saw him fly into the jaws of the nightmare child. So...he needs to die, just like Rose's father needed to die...or time and space will start to unravel in some way.
Dalek Caan knows this but brought Davros back anyway. So that something ELSE could happen...maybe so that the Doctor's soul could be revealed. Maybe all the time lines end here...not because of the Daleks...but because of the thing with all the prophecy around it...the DoctorDonna...10.2...something brand new in creation, a human/time lord hybrid. "You should not exist," the shadow lady says about 10...and 10 says that about 10.2.
Maybe this really was all about what the prophecy said...the Journey's End...because the Doctor has crossed the line into total identification with his Lonely Godhood. Everything stops there...because he can go back and MAKE it stop. And...since he knows it is possible to break the time lock...how tempting will it be for him to just...fix everything? He could save everyone.
I tell you what there is more than a prophecy that he will do this...there is a canon season...the Trial of the Time Lord. Ten is now a point between regenerations, I think...and we have been watching his descent into the madness of the Valeyard since he arrived. We just didn't know it. Because RTD eclipsed it for a time with the bright sun of Rose Tyler. But now...the Darkness is coming, indeed.
Ten needs someone to stop him...and there's nobody left. I see a bad moon risin'.
Or...you know...that could just be because I've adjusted my meds. :grin:
At this point...Journey's End was what it was, yeah? A bit of big budget epic designed to make as many people as possible happy and the time lords are coming back for Moffat and Eleven will make it all better. New companion on the horizon...I guess. :grin:
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but I've come back to talk for England
Date: 2008-07-17 01:52 pm (UTC)In all the discussions I'm seeing, no-one's asking deeply what the Doctor wants (not needs). Is it fair to ask Brown to watch Rose wither and die? Would Rose really want to put him through that? She wants him safe, but does that include protecting him from losing her by means beyond his control - enemies, natural ageing? If he extends her life, she'll stop being the bright human spark he loves. If he keeps her to travel with him, he knows through Davros that enemies will manipulate her in order to hurt both of them. He doesn't want her to see his full self, his soul. That doesn't seem like a good basis for a relationship. As others have said here, he's a bad man when Rose is taken from him. Giving her away freely might make things easier for him. He's sent Rose away from him three times now, and she is willing to collapse two realities to be with him. The focus on the small picture at the expense of the big one is a little disturbing to me. But it's also a bit like Martha's devotion, that no matter how far he pushes her away, she keeps coming back.
Bad Wolf Bay. I don't think Blue/Rose is a loveless marriage. I think it's an arranged one. In religious studies at school, arranged marriages were explained to me as "I learned to love my husband after we were married" and the marriages were arranged in part because the Elders honestly believed their personalities were a good match. In bad cases, it reads as "old men dictate your life, get used to it." I don't think we needed to hear what Blue whispered in Rose's ear. I got a lip reader friend not familiar with Who to come and look at it, and before I even asked she said "I love you." Once I explained, she unenthusiastically added it could be "like humans do" but stressed there was no context, no beginning to that sentence. But the beach scene really pushed the boundaries on what Who can be, and I think hearing 'I love you,' the Doctor's name or seeing the Doctor's genitals would break it. All these things can and have been hinted at. What I think should have been said by Brown (if this was the end) was, "Please, Rose. For me." But no, the Dark Lord is coming.
See? I will give this all proper thought
Date: 2008-07-17 02:22 pm (UTC)That says a lot about the Doctor's mindset...and plays into his suicide in Left Turn. He doesn't kill the Family of Blood, he makes them suffer for all eternity. Dead is a welcome release. This is what Rassilon knew, too.
Ten gives 10.2 the gift HE wants. A short, sweet life with Rose and death. But it is a gift he has stated he can "never have." If 10.2 really does what he is told...if he is passive...and he certainly appears to be once 10 arrives...then he will do what Rose tells him to do. Again...not a good marriage partner. But also, Rose won't stop then, either.
I am of the admittedly small minority of people who think that there is no way love can bloom under these circumstances. Because even if it IS an arranged marriage...and he is like 10 in every way...Rose knows 10 is still alone. 10 needed to say he was okay alone...but he didn't. He implied it with the idea that Rose had healed him...but still...
The Dark Lord is coming. I firmly believe Rose and 10 need each other to stop. I think she would tear down the universe to get to him...and if 10.2 can't stop her...who can?
Also, we must actually look at Rose's motivation for wanting to be with 10...it isn't that she loves him. She DOES love him. But her motivation in constantly returning to him has always been..."He does it alone, mum." So, 10.2 would have to convince her that his other self is just fine.
And I think the reason 10.2 goes along with things is that he's the Doctor. The Doctor would have listened to Cassandra's mad prophecies. He would have seen the truth in them. The Doctor used to be thoughtful and far less volcanic...he used to be agreeable. He used to see things clearly...go along with things and then...cheerfully put a stop to whatever was going wrong.
Besides 10.2 can't ask 10 for what he needs...10's body. That would have to be freely given. In other words...you can't force the Dark Lord back into his bottle. He has to want to change or the change simply won't hold. I think Rose and Dalek Caan both saw the same thing when they saw all of Time and Space. Rose tried to love the dark out of the Doctor...tried to stay with him forever...and so off-set the darkness. But that failed. So...Caan has tried to bring the dark out ahead of time.
You see, Caan said...all of this would have happened anyway...he just pushed it ahead...manipulated things when he was the Bad Wolf. This is why Dalek Caan said that Rose and 10 must both be caged and there...because the Doctor must have a choice...at all times. And it could well be that 10.2 is allowing that choice to unfold in its own time.
It could also be that 10.2 needs Donna as much as Donna needs him. He could need her spark of independence in his head. She gives him so much of his old self back...really...the need to explore...the end to romantic notions...the fun...and a little of the uncertainty he once had. Donna would save one family...even if you couldn't save the whole city.
Rae