Star Trek: Into Darkness...Spoilers

[rabid1st]

Does this need a cut? Is there anyone who has held out longer than me...unspoiled? I don't know. But, I shall give it a cut anyway, because, while I feel all of my friends went to see it the first day...someone new might stumble on this journal and be spoiled.

KHHHHAAAAAANNNNN! Not only did I mention how obvious this was after the Super Bowl add... http://rabid1st.livejournal.com/383892.html#comments

...but...also, they reimagined that very scene I used to illuminate the choice. And, therein, lies the flaw of this film. It was ticking off some boxes and I sort of wish that it wasn't doing that. I thought the new crew looked silly in those scenes. Specifically like they were re-imagining an iconic moment. Which is what they were doing. It took me out of the scene to recognize it and see it done from another direction. On the other hand, the reboot on Khan was mostly well done. Even though I was expecting him, they almost fooled me into thinking Cumberbatch (Who my companion called Blunderbuss...which is hilarious) was playing someone else. Almost. But, as I said originally, you simply wouldn't cast Benedict to play anyone else.

So, I said HA! very loudly in the theater and my sister, who went with me, got irked. "Yeah, you told us so." she snarked, later. Perhaps I was crowing too much, because, as I said in the above link, most historic Star Trek watchers would be expecting him...especially after the Super Bowl ad. It is much like expecting the Valeyard to show up in DW. It won't be surprising if he does...because he is destined. And Khan is much the same. But, it is about time to stop ticking those boxes with New Trek. I want to see a few new adventures. I would have loved for Khan and Kirk to have worked together. And therein lies the second serious misstep of this series. They went the wrong way with Khan. Khan should have seen reason, rather than gone on a genocidal rampage. However, I did like that the main issue my S.O. had with the reboot has now been corrected. They appear to be behaving more civilized than current mankind. And I am glad that JJ Abrams got that memo.

Star Trek has always been a show about the best in mankind rising to the top. And a vengeful, reckless Kirk is not part of that ideal. Kirk was bold and a brilliant strategist, but he had a civilized, live and let live core attitude that was sorely lacking in the first film of this reboot. I was very happy to see him tempered a bit in this film. Growing up and becoming more of an explorer than a soldier. Daring, yes, dangerous in a fight, certainly, but also a man who did his best to save others.

Overall, this movie pleased me a lot. I wish Kirk and Khan had found a better truce. My feeling was that while the original Kirk and Khan got off on the wrong foot, they were a lot alike...and so I was happy to see them find some common ground in this one. But then Khan goes to mindless terrorist and I just wish he hadn't. I wanted Kirk and Khan to broker a peace with each other, and then the Klingons, pushed to it early by that mad Admiral. Though, a truce might have led to Khan and his kind growing too powerful again...especially if they had a foothold in the Klingon Empire...which would, frankly, suit them. And that might lead to Wrath of Khan again. So, perhaps that is why Abrams decided to find another solution than abandonment/isolation of Khan and his crew. And it was a peaceful solution, so I am satisfied. Also, Spock got to kick some ass. Always fun. Though chubby cheeked Spock did make me smile sometimes. I've never seen Zachary that chubby cheeked. I wonder if he had some allergic reaction to his ears.

Oh, and I shouldn't leave without giving mad props to Simon Pegg and whoever that is that plays Bones. They were both so spot on it was uncanny. Pegg's Scotty is the main reason I will get this movie for my very small DVD collection. He's amazing in this movie. He was pretty darned good in the first one. Pine is also much better in this one. He's become Kirk for me at last. So, the only one I don't like that much is Uhura. Though, I've always liked that actress. And I'm not against her romance with Spock. One of the many great moments in this movie was the moment when Uhura and Spock have their tiff and Kirk is wanting no part in it...then piles on...and then it all turns rather sweet. I loved the unexpected realism there that is intrinsic to THIS crew and, yet, reflective of the original series. To me, that's when the reboot shines, when it dares to do something new. No more "reimagining" of classic moments...please...because it isn't necessary.

Comments

[dharkapparition.livejournal.com]

Karl Urban plays Bones. He's one of my favs. I really enjoyed this second movie. I saw the original ST:WoK movie in the theater so my memory of it is vague. I watched a lot of ST tvshow but not all since it was a rare thing that my Dad let me stay up for it. But I enjoyed all of the incarnations I was able to view, including the reboots so far.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

I don't know Karl, but he's great. I enjoyed this movie, too. I can't say Khan wouldn't have wanted world domination, but he would have been great with the Klingons...and could have come back, too. Led the Klingon war, perhaps. I should write ST:3...hee,

[ericadawn16.livejournal.com]

Karl will forever be EOMER to me, hehe. He was also on Xena a bunch of times.

[susanb03.livejournal.com]

I haven't seen it, nor at this point do I intend to. I get so tired of 'remakes'. There seem to be very few NEW ideas. And New Who doesn't count as a remake as it had DIFFERENT stories.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

This film clunked along when doing fanservice and soared when doing original things with familiar characters. DW was not a reimagining under RTD, but is under Moff,

[susanb03.livejournal.com]

"DW was not a reimagining under RTD, but is under Moff"
Too true!

[wickedgillie.livejournal.com]

I think JJ evoked a standard trope of AU fics--namely, to revisit events and show that some things are simply pre-destined regardless of how things change. Embracing that trope, this worked for me. Even my husband, who hates the whole bloody reboot (and how it has shit upon canon) enjoyed the film.

Also, despite unspoiled and never having seen the Super Bowl trailer (I boycott all-things Ravens, being a Steelers fan), I knew with 90% certainty that Benedict simply had to be Khan.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

I think he pretty much had to be...as I say in my post-Super Bowl post...who else would you cast him as? There is something about Benedict that reeks superior intellect, isn't there? That high forehead perhaps.

Anyway, I don't mind them playing with the Tropes...it is the lack of imagination in their play that irks me. I would have played out the Khan/Kirk alliance to the very end. It was over way too soon for me, especially when we have a Mad Admiral...and the idea of a Khan love interest right there in his daughter. This time she would be more of a warrior than McGivers was, standing by Khan in the fight against her father, but siding with the Enterprise crew. Khan could take her hostage in the end, to escape.

[jedi_of_urth]

I pretty much laughed all through the big death scene...which I don't think was the intended response. It just came off as silly to me, plus unearned by this crew. Plus how obvious it was that it wasn't going to stick. It really just felt...like you said, ticking boxes rather than actual story craft being employed. And they could have reimagined Khan into a whole new situation (or you know, imagined a new antagonist), but they didn't.

The did early on almost fool me that it may not have to be Khan too, I thought a Section 31 related plot would be just the thing to really bring this reboot world into its own, and take us into darkness as the title promised. You could do so much with Section 31, and they almost took us there, but in the end...they played it safe and had them fight Khan.

I did more or less enjoy the movie, but the end really made me feel like the reboot world is...kind of lazy.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

I laughed as well. And I might have groaned a little. It definitely wasn't the least bit dramatic...because we knew Bones knew that Khan's blood could save Jim...because of the earlier Tribble scene. As I say below, I think it would have been far better to have Khan be the only one that knew that. Khan and the audience, because we saw him save that little girl in the beginning. And it would have been far, far better if Kirk had been dying of radiation poisoning, rather than DEAD. I barely bought the rebirth of old school Spock...and that was with a genesis device at work.

I feel if you are going to do a reboot, then you might want to really change up the series. Having Khan a reluctant ally was a good idea, but they didn't have the nerve to play it out to the end and make a great movie. Khan and Kirk working together each on a ship to save the Earth from destruction. That's a great idea. Let the Mad Admiral have true conviction. Let Khan and his daughter have their shot at romance as they try to figure out/reverse what Mad Admiral has done to the ship. Let daughter kill father...to save Khan and Earth, thereby cementing Khan's attraction to her. And finally, let Khan try to escape, much as he does, only to have Spock go after him to save Jim. Now...that's a movie.

So, it was more or less and enjoyable, but, yes, a kind of lazy movie.

[jedi_of_urth]

The thing that really confused me was...why couldn't Spock kill Khan when they had the 72 other augments on hand that they could get healing blood from? There's no reason to thinks Khan's blood is special among the augments, for that matter, doesn't it raise some ethical questions about how they could just use the frozen augments' blood to cure injuries/illness/etc. in the Federation? But yeah, having it be something Khan knew and used to save Kirk thereby making them even more into uncomfortable allies would have been much more interesting.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

I thought about that, too, re: the other augments. But, I thought it was one of those things where they didn't want to wait on an experiment to find out if the other augments were just the same as Khan. They could have all been different, after all. But it would have been better to explain THAT point if that was their reasoning. All it would have taken was a couple of lines..."Wake up another one." "There isn't time to check anyone else."

Rae
who is glad you like my uneasy alliance idea. I think it would have created a lot more tension and, thus, a better film.

[auntiesuze.livejournal.com]

I think the whole "box ticking" thing is the issue that most folks have with it. I enjoyed the movie a lot, there was some fantastic acting, but most of the plot resolution (including the "death" scene) was so obvious/heavily foreshadowed that there weren't any surprises. Heck, I would have been happier if they'd just admitted from day 1 that this was Khan, rather than trying to mislead the audience. It was far too obvious (particularly once the trailers started being released) that it *was* Khan, and it just made TPTB look foolish for trying to deny that.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

Well, I don't know. They had me fooled within the movie. I had about given up on it being Khan when they opened that torpedo. But, that that moment, it did look remarkably convoluted...like an obvious attempt to hide something from the audience that you wouldn't necessarily hide from the show characters. But, after a second of HA! and Come On! I did buy into the new program. That someone else found Khan and woke just him and made him into their monkeyboy. And I started to think what that might do to him...and I was totally with him, until he turned on Kirk just because he was superior. It sort of made him look less intelligent, to me.

I would rather he had played a longer and more intricate game with Kirk. So, no Old Spock...in my view. Or...Old Spock being more or less dismissed as not relevant to the new circumstances...and then either being vindicated by Khan turning...or...really being wrong about this reality. Basically, I would have set up the next movie...a Klingon war movie for sure...by having Khan and his people settle a planet in the Klingon neutral zone. Then, later, had a Khan/Kirk confrontation. Because Benedict could easily do two movies...and probably would if he had a juicy role to play.

So, basically, if they had let me look over this script. I would have pointed out that the Mad Admiral could have done everything Khan did...send the Enterprise crashing to earth, etc. Then Khan and Kirk could have infiltrated only to have the Mad Admiral set the ship to crash into Earth. Then, while Khan fights to save the big ship, Kirk rushes back to the Enterprise to try and save her. And we have the great scenes of two ships crashing to earth that we wanted...and Khan tries to escape...and Jim dies. Spock, instead of having the exact moment copied...learns from Khan (or maybe Bones) that Khan can save Jim...but Khan would rather save himself. Spock is in talks with Khan...when Khan cuts him off...and KHHHHAAAANNN! Spock goes after him like a mad man and brings him in unconscious. They decide to keep him that way. Or, they put him and his people ashore in the neutral zone, because Spock promises him that. So, Kirk and Khan part as adversarial friends.

[karie22.livejournal.com]

Averting my eyes, not reading anything, just popping in to say thanks for the cut! I was planning to see this with my step-dad on opening weekend, and that same day he managed to fall off a roof and fracture his spine. So I'm waiting for him to be able to go and sit through it (he's in this horribly uncomfortable brace right now), since I'd feel badly if I saw it without him.

So, yeah, still a few stragglers out here! Thanks for being considerate, not everyone is. I've had to avert my eyes from quite a few posts lately!

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

You are welcome. I hate when people spoil me with their LJ flailing. Use your cut tags, I say.

And I'm sorry to hear about your Dad. Wish him a speedy recovery from me. Tell him the movie is good. :grin:

[karie22.livejournal.com]

I will, and thank you! He's definitely looking forward to it! :)

[asahifirsa.livejournal.com]

I wish someone would gave taken the time to tell Khan that his crew wasn't in the torpedos that exploded. The guy thought that his whole crew, his whole FAMILY had been killed. I imagine Kirk wouldn't have been able to not vengeance in that case either. For Spock we don't even have to imagine it as he went quite as batshit crazy as Khan when he thought Kirk was dead (well, he was dead, but you know what I mean). So... COMMUNICATION.

I think it was well done how we sympathized with Khan, even if I maybe overdid it at all, as that scene where he thought his whole crew was dead broke my heart :(

I loved the short segment of scenes where Khan and Kirk worked together. I'm glad they did not kill him off though. Would be nice to see him again.

I wish they'd do a HQ HBO-type TV-series next instead of another movie. With a movie every 4-5 years they'll never be able to tell the story properly before the actors get too old :(

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

I wish they'd do a HQ HBO-type TV-series next instead of another movie. With a movie every 4-5 years they'll never be able to tell the story properly before the actors get too old :(


You know, I had this exact thought when Kirk announced the "five year mission." I thought, well...that's about two movies and then Disney is recasting. And the thought of recasting this crew really bothers me. I don't think the PTB have figured out that while you can recast an OLD crew...it is harder to get us to like...say...a new Spiderman or Ironman.

As for Khan's attitude being linked to his fear of all his crew being dead. That could well be the case. I will look for that next time I watch. I, too, loved Khan and Kirk working together and I felt the Mad Admiral could have been expanded into a more threatening character, pushing for a Klingon war that we Next Generation fans might not want to see happen. And I really do feel Khan and his kind would fit in better with Klingon society than human...giving us more people like Worf in this universe and, perhaps, an impetus for the war.

Rae