Doctor Who: Seriously don't read this!

[rabid1st]

Okay, you can read this. But, I might have figured out what is going on with S7. So, consider yourself warned! If you read this it might spoil you. Then, again, I've been wrong many times before...

So, I heard about the Zygons. And you Old School people might remember a couple of things about them...beyond the suckers and the flat head, I mean. First, they are shape-shifters, which could neatly answer the question of how we have the Tenth Doctor and Rose again. Zygons in disguise. But, everyone is going to think of that. I am still on a virtual reality kick with them. Because, even better than shape-shifting is point number 2 about Zygons...they use organic tech in their ships. And, oh, where else did we see organic tech? In the Moff story, "The Girl in the Fireplace" that's where. And where again? In the first episode of this season, when Clara was basically a machine with a human sensibility. And, who likes to reuse his own ideas? Moff!

But, here's the thing, if the Zygons had captured the Doctor and were using him to run their ship's computer. He would certainly be a Great Intelligence. And he and Clara could be parts of the same complex, acting out things from the Doctor's memory. Because she is his real companion, or she is several people who died. In which case, it could mean that Ten/Rose are real, from the actual past...and are trying to unhook the Doctor from the contraption. Because the third thing about the Zygons is that they already appeared in Season 7, but they seemed to cause no real problems for the Doctor. We didn't even see them in The Power of Three, but they were there. So, it is possible they also captured the Doctor at some point and successfully wired him up to their tech. Of course, we will have some rollicking references to old times...as the Doctor does...REMEMBER. He will have to answer the question "Doctor Who?" for the anniversary, probably via flashbacks and virtual recreations like Ten/Rose. And that means, the appearance coming up, while lovely, will be essentially meaningless for the Ten/Rose fans.

Comments

[yumimum.livejournal.com]

I'm totally on board with this theory. There were a lot of references to previous adventures etc in the last ep, and I'm convinced this is them trying to reach him on a subconcious level. My only flaw with this plan is my doubts that the Moff is smart enough to string it all together...

At least if they are figments/or shapeshifters in the 50th he can't screw up any head canons :)

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

I, too, am behind this idea mainly because it could give us one more Rose/Ten adventure and still leave us all with our lovely headcanon. But, we must not forget that we will have Eleven trying to explain about Rose and Ten to Clara. So, we are bound to get some canon insight into that relationship...as Eleven sees it. A sort of Sarah Jane meets Rose moment, only without as much emotional impact.

Rae

[wickedgillie.livejournal.com]

This makes too much sense for Moff to have thought of it. Hopefully someone smart thought of it for him.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

I don't know. I mean, I dislike what Moff has done to commercialize the Doctor, making more of an icon than a character. And I don't like that he's been turned into a sexualized clown figure. But, while his plots are usually too convoluted to not be irritating, he does follow through on them.

And he's really big on subtle clues to his eventual reveal. I do think that Matt's change of attitude, dress, TARDIS configuaration...are big clues that something is wrong with the Doctor. Maybe it is not the Zygons though, that would require some attention to the past show.

[wickedgillie.livejournal.com]

Can I give you mad props for using "sexualized" and "clown" in the same sentence? Although truly, that's spot on the mark.

The mind boggles that the show runner who has undone nearly 50 years of character growth is the very same person who gave both John & Sherlock so much soul and realness.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

I think the difference with Sherlock is that he comes at it from an adult perspective. He talked it over with Mark Gatiss, who probably would have scoffed at taking too many liberties. I suppose the difference is that Moff gave Sherlock Holmes fans some respect. I don't think he realized how many of us were the SAME fans.

Think how giddy and goofy and childlike David and RTD become when they discuss Doctor Who. Moff, no doubt, feels that he can entertain his own childish impulses with the Doctor. I suppose we should feel sorry for him that he's forgotten, or never experienced, the pure sense of wonder and boldness and cleverness and love that is childhood. Perhaps he was picked on as a child and responded, not by developing empathy, but by wanting to be bigger and more powerful than the bullies.

A couple of days ago, I came across a clip of David interviewing Moff about Doctor Who and it was interesting to note how soft spoken and cerebral Moff was in the clip. I liked him and felt a little guilty about all the shots I take at him. But I didn't feel like he completely understood what makes DW work, which I instantly felt from RTD. RTD was on fire, the way that I get, about it all. Moff, too me, has a box of toys and no idea how to play with them.

[dragon-bait21.livejournal.com]

Yea about the whole sexualization thing. I read a really weird fic the other day that made me glad Eleven isn't hung up on Rose, because it fits too well with the character as written by Moffat. The premise is that he misses Rose so goes back in time before she meets Nine. He scares off Jimmy Stone but ends up sleeping with Rose instead. We have the whole rewriting someone's history, casual sex, all those things we see from Moffat's Eleven, which just irritate me around River give me the heebie jeebies when applied to Rose.

As for your theory I don't know enough old school to recognize Zygons but it sounds eminently plausible. Lip service to us 10/Rose fans without actually having them in the story.

[rabid1st.livejournal.com]

You know, I started reading that same fic and had to stop. I'm not a big fan of Eleven/Rose anyway, though I would buy it if someone was selling. But I don't want him messing with her pre-Nine. I didn't particularly care of the red bicycle when you were nine quote, because I rather liked Nine growing fond of her in person. Maybe I just don't find the idea of knowing your love since childhood to be that romantic. Especially if one of you wasn't a child at all. I think the issues of the age gap between Rose and the Doctor are already screwy enough without compounding it all. Many people say to me, well, humans are already like children to him. And I would say, yes...that's one reason he didn't leap on Rose immediately. They were both rather resistant for people who were quite obviously dippy about one another...and RTD did explore all of their issues, in nicely subtle fashion...that was lost on many of the fans.

I always return to the "I'd have to settle down. Buy a house with doors and carpets. Imagine me, living in a house." I can't tell you how much it burns me up to hear people claim that ROSE was forcing him to be domestic. HE wanted to buy the house. She just asked him what they were going to do. And she asked if he could build another TARDIS.

I know I'm preaching to the choir here, but this idea that saturates the fandom so much that it led to that horror at the end of JE...that Rose wants babies and a house and is clinging to the Doctor to get them...is just not part of canon until that moment in JE. And even then, RTD had the grace to have Rose resist the offer, run after HER Doctor and insist that something wasn't right. That kiss was edited properly in my opinion...because there was no way that Rose was satisfied with the deal. And frankly, she'd already addressed that a Doctor that looked exactly like her Doctor but wasn't really HIM...wasn't what she wanted. She addresses that straight after the aborted regeneration..."You're still you?" She asks, before she hugs the stuffing out of him.

[dragon-bait21.livejournal.com]

I don't mind 11/Rose in an AU setting, but most of those aren't written with 11 having quite the same personality Moffat gave him. I don't like his overt sexuality around River and I want that 11 to stay a long way away from Rose.
Do you think they will put River in the 50th? I alternate between loathing her and feeling sorry for her.

[mrs_roy.livejournal.com]

When did Who get so freakin complicated? Give me Tom Baker and his crappy CGI any day! There's a saying - Less is more.

Eh. So glad I'm done with it all.